Ok if GM/Ford go under?

[Frank W]

Ford has been talking about an electric F150 for more than 5 years now.... and we still know nothing about it - I'm not holding my breath.... that's why I reserved a CT.

And now GM plans a 400 mile pickup.
https://apple.news/ATSNuo85YQXahNGBr7YJ_uQ

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[jerhenderson]

And now GM plans a 400 mile pickup.
https://apple.news/ATSNuo85YQXahNGBr7YJ_uQ

GM has even less credibility than Ford does.

 

[bkarrer]

I agree with everything you said. Plus, I feel all the retiree's would be hurt too. It's not the workers fault that the company they put their blood and sweet into gets disrupted and left in the dust. GM and Ford are stuck in a hard place. It will be difficult to phase in EV's and make their other ICE vehicles obsolete. Plus their business model relies on the dealer network with parts & maintenance being a major part of the profits. Tesla has lots of advantages over the old Giants of industry.

Don't worry so much about who will and will not survive in the market place. Best to let the consumer decide. The reality is, there will be a demand for vehicles. Whatever the demand is, workers will be needed to fill the demand. If the demand shifts to Tesla and away from Ford, (for example), the Ford worker is not necessarily out of a job. They just take their talents to Tesla, where they are now needed because of the demand.

Right now, I don't see ANYONE near matching Tesla's overall EV package. If they come anywhere near matching battery life or range, they totally lose any advantage in the full self driving category. One may have Auto Pilot as good as any aircraft but without collision avoidance, auto pilot is nearly useless as a safety feature. Collision avoidance is where FSD really shines and improves everyday with neural learning. The others have a whole lot of catching up to do!

However, one must always be vigilant as fortunes can, all too often, "turn on a dime". A couple of major blunders can be very humbling.

 

[TeslaHugger]

I would prefer Ford and GM stay so they could continue to demonstrate their inferiority to Tesla.

I can understand that thinking but I think I would rather have EV manufactures compete with each other and innovate the future. But I'm pretty sure that will happen whether ICE manufactures exists or not.

GM has even less credibility than Ford does.

Agreed, GM lost all credibility with me when they killed EV1. We could be talking about GM dominating the EV market right now.

 

[ztirffritz]

None of the legacy Mfgs have any battery production capacity. At the moment, they could make 1,000,000 eF-150 trucks with no batteries. But if you want batteries in them you’d be limited to maybe 20k. The most successful non-Tesla EV is probably the Chevy Bolt and they sold 16k units in 2019. Imagine telling your supplier we need 1000% more production in 6months. It’s not going to happen.

I agree. It's the whole "chicken and egg" conundrum. They are going to have to rely on existing or emerging charging infrastructure at first. They'll never get anywhere with a propriety plug like Tesla has. However, it's possible that their "network" could outstrip Tesla's fairly quickly as they don't have to put out funds to build the network out. They can leave that to someone else. Of course, that won't give them much of an advantage over anyone except companies with proprietary plugs like Tesla. Of course, owners of Teslas can also charge at other places. It's just that Fords can't charge at Tesla chargers.

However, if Ford suddenly starts popping out F-150E and Mach E vehicles in volumes Tesla can't match, businesses that are looking to put a couple of charge locations at their stores will be less inclined to exclude all the Fords by installing Tesla-specific equipment and will most likely opt for universal-style charging stations.

 

[DPye_BC]

I'm Canadian so take my opinion about US politics for what it's worth...
I think it's inevitable that Ford, GM and others will go under once sticker price parity hits and they have no competitive EVs to offer the consumer. The gov't will bail them out but I hope it is sensible enough to mandate that they stop making ICE vehicles entirely. Tesla wants to accelerate the transition to sustainable energy and they can't do it on their own. Other mfrs have to make the 100% commitment to EVs that Tesla has. That will probably necessitate a push from gov't as well as a pull from consumers.

 

[SantasCybertruck]

Legacy manufacturers have a dilemma. They can go out of business with the old dealership model of cash flow through new car sales, repairs and used car sales or sell million mile EV's that won't need repairs, are constantly updated and will last for many more years.
However, profit by selling EV's will also decline once Self Driving is perfected and Robo-Taxis create a continuing cash flow without selling cars for a one time profit.
I think by necessity new companies will need to be created to displace the old ones although they could be funded by the traditional manufacturers before they are choked by legacy debt and union pensions/health care plans and still maintain some of the branding.

 

[MEDICALJMP]

None of the legacy Mfgs have any battery production capacity. At the moment, they could make 1,000,000 eF-150 trucks with no batteries. But if you want batteries in them you’d be limited to maybe 20k. The most successful non-Tesla EV is probably the Chevy Bolt and they sold 16k units in 2019. Imagine telling your supplier we need 1000% more production in 6months. It’s not going to happen.

Exactly. You have to shift so much if the production to EV and it just does not happen over night. It isn't just batteries, it's the electric motors and alterations to the assembly line.

It also involves a alteration of the buyer's mindset. You can make all the EVs you want, but until the majority of the car buying public wants them you have expensive hulks sitting in your lots waiting to be sold.

Right now the majority of car buyers are gas-centric.

 

[strongsafety31]

I don't think the Fed will let the legacy car manufacturers go under. They will bail them out which probably in the long run is better because the competition will be intense and it will force everyone to innovate. Tesla is very good at innovating and not sitting on their ass, so they will maintain their lead and domination.

 

[Adamtbest]

I don't know if the 3 big auto manufactures would ever go out of business. I've known people that are very brand loyal, ie they only shop Chevys, Fords or Dodges. While I've driven Chevy's for 15 years, I'm looking forward to a CT.

 

[CostcoSamples]

Any company that can’t compete should be left alone to fail.

legacy auto has grown way to bureaucratic and needs to get swept away by the market.

 

[Cybe]

I'm making no predictions until I'm able to put an actual CT through its paces. I'll make the switch once the actual vehicle PROVES itself to be superior. I've never been brand loyal...all manufacturers have their winners and their losers and specs on paper mean nothing to me. I'm the end user and if Tesla can win me over collectively, then the big 3, and others will have something to worry about.

 

[ericpdb2]

I would prefer Ford and GM stay so they could continue to demonstrate their inferiority to Tesla.

It would please me if GM perished today. The Corvette is the only worthwhile product they produce. Let Ford survive. T F Series pickups are the best available for those without the courage and wisdom to buy a CT.

 

[Frank W]

I just Googled problems with 2020 Corvette and people are complaining about panel gaps, ergonomic issues in the cabin, issues with the wavy stitching interior, as well as problems with the front hood flying open. All of this from a manufacturer that has been in the business for many many years. UAW employees average salary according to 1 website is $90K a year. If that’s the average think how high it could be for some. I’m so glad that Tesla is not interested in joining this union And I’m looking forward to getting a CT.

 

[PeterCapomolla]

I am an Australian I have seen our car industry disappear one manufacturer at a time since I was an apprentice motor mechanic in early 1970's - British Leyland, Chrysler, Mitsubishi, Ford, GM /Holden - they are all gone - they could not adapt - When SUV's became popular GM kept making cars that few wanted - they just did not adapt - finally when the Government after spending $Billions to keep them afloat said no more handouts - they were gone our last car - I think a smart Australian Government would offer an incentive to Tesla to build a factory here - I am sure the public would embrace another Aussie built car - Price of a Model 3 or a Single Motor Cybretruck here would be approx $76,000 out of the price range of average consumer - locally produced would see a price reduction, maybe some government incentives - I can only dream that this will happen sooner rather than later -