Nikola is going to crush Tesla with its new technology!

[CappyJax]

Then this happened and will continue to happen when dealing with hydrogen.

Still less dangerous than gas or diesel.

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[Ehninger1212]

Still less dangerous than gas or diesel.

Yep.. just google Texas city disaster 1947. One of the largest non nuclear explosions ever.

 

[Crissa]

Yep.. just google Texas city disaster 1947. One of the largest non nuclear explosions ever.

Wasn't that fertilizer, tho?

-Crissa

 

[Ehninger1212]

Wasn't that fertilizer, tho?

-Crissa

Yes.. but it was the ignition of all the nearby refineries which caused the massive explosion. The fertilizer was just the fuse.

 

[ajdelange]

Yep.. just google Texas city disaster 1947. One of the largest non nuclear explosions ever.

Good old ammonium nitrate. Grows crops in the desert and clears the rocks out of the way so I can build my garage but also did a pretty good job flattening Corpus Christie and, more recently, Beirut. And I think perhaps the biggest non nuclear explosion to date, if not Beirut, was when the allies undermined miles of German trenches in WW I.

 

[Ehninger1212]

Another good one to look at is the 1978 Texas city explosion.. And then another at the BP refinery in 2005 (My father was at that one)

 

[ajdelange]

The bottom line here is that an H2 FUDster has implied that we ought not consider hydrogen as a fuel because a hydrogen plant blew up. Following that line of reasoning we ought not to fertilize our fields with ammonium nitrate because fertilizer plants/storage facilities have blown up nor heat our homes with natural gas because there have been natural gas explosions nor generate electricity from nuclear because of Fukujima and Chernobyl nor treat our water with chlorine because some trucker dumped sulfuric acid into a hypochlorite tank nor drink beer because a huge vat once burst drowning many and destroying a London neighborhood. We should all huddle in our yurts and heat our yogurt over a wood burning stove

 

[Ehninger1212]

The bottom line here is that an H2 FUDster has implied that we ought not consider hydrogen as a fuel because a hydrogen plant blew up. Following that line of reasoning we ought not to fertilize our fields with ammonium nitrate because fertilizer plants/storage facilities have blown up nor heat our homes with natural gas because there have been natural gas explosions nor generate electricity from nuclear because of Fukujima and Chernobyl nor treat our water with chlorine because some trucker dumped sulfuric acid into a hypochlorite tank nor drink beer because a huge vat once burst drowning many and destroying a London neighborhood. We should all huddle in our yurts and heat our yogurt over a wood burning stove

But what about the great yurt collapse of 1842?

All jokes aside, i agree.. i still dont think H2 is the best approach. But i know its wayyyy batter for the environment than any type of oil. So yeah i would rather see a bunch of H2 semis vs Diesel. But i would WAYY rather see a bunch of TESLA semis!

 

[Crissa]

Don't forget the molasses explosion in Boston!

No sugary drinks!

-Crissa

 

[Handy Artie]

But what about the great yurt collapse of 1842?

All jokes aside, i agree.. i still dont think H2 is the best approach. But i know its wayyyy batter for the environment than any type of oil. So yeah i would rather see a bunch of H2 semis vs Diesel. But i would WAYY rather see a bunch of TESLA semis!

Trees are good for the environment too. They are natures first solar plant. They use solar energy captured in chlorophyll to combine CO2 and H2O into carbohydrates and oxygen. It’s called photosynthesis. Trees were our first fuel and wood pellets from saw dust are popular heating fuels today. Without oxygen to breath you can’t have people and you also can’t have fires. Green New Deal politicians focus too much on CO2 instead of trees and oxygen. Politicians tend to like living in cities without enough trees. A lot of them act and think like they’re oxygen deprived, like breathing air at flight level 250 in an unpressurized airplane. Many of them now prefer to hide out in their basements. They should be outdoors planting trees.

 

[ajdelange]

Trees are good for the environment too. They are natures first solar plant. They use solar energy captured in chlorophyll to combine CO2 and H2O into carbohydrates and oxygen.

I am just so intrigued by this process that I am going to bore you all again with what is actually happening here. Oxygen loves electrons. In photosynthesis the energy from a photon tears electrons away from the oxygen atoms is water and CO2 and transfers them to the hydrogen and carbon atoms of a carbohydrate (6CO2 + 6H20 --> C6H12O6 + 6O2). To get that energy back we burn the carbohydrate resulting in the reverse reaction and the release of the sun's energy as heat. The only reason we walk on the surface of the earth is that we have evolved elaborate biochemistry to permit that reverse reaction to take place at a controlled rate.

So now lets consider a molecule of LinMjO2 in which M represents atoms of some transition element. Lets take the photon's energy and turn it into electrical energy and use that energy to pull an electron off this molecule resulting in the ion LinMjO2+. This ion will quickly separate into Li+ + Li(n-1)MjO2. The electric apparatus that pulls the electron off the lithium salt transfers it to a sheet of carbon which charges it negatively. This attracts the Li+ ion which gets reduced to LiC6. Look familiar? We've used the sun's energy to transfer electrons from one substance to carbon. IOW we have stored the sun's energy in Lithium carbide in this case as opposed to a carbohydrate in photosynthesis. To get the energy back all we have to do is connect a motor between the LiC6 and the Li(n-1)MjO2 and the reaction reverses restoring the electrons to the oxygen atoms in the Lithium Metal Oxide molecule.

With photosynthesis we store the suns energy (perhaps for thousands of years) in a carbohydrate and then burn it, supplying oxygen for this, at our convenience to get back the original CO2 and H20 from which the carbohydrate came. With the battery we store the sun's energy in lithium carbide and "burn" it to get the original carbon and lithium salt from which it came. "Burn" in both cases means transferring electrons from carbon to oxygen. The big difference with the battery is, of course, that neither the original oxidized substance nor the oxidation product leave or enter the cell. They are already there. The only thing that enters and leaves is the electrons.

I guess to make the discussion complete I should point out that a fuel cell works the same way except that the sun's energy is used to transfer electrons to hydrogen atoms and that the hydrogen atoms are loaded into the "battery" continuously on one side which the "oxide" (that is, oxygen itself) is loaded into the other. The stored energy is that of electrons flowing from the hydrogen side to the oxygen side through an external circuit as is the case with the battery.

 

[CappyJax]

The bottom line here is that an H2 FUDster has implied that we ought not consider hydrogen as a fuel because a hydrogen plant blew up. Following that line of reasoning we ought not to fertilize our fields with ammonium nitrate because fertilizer plants/storage facilities have blown up nor heat our homes with natural gas because there have been natural gas explosions nor generate electricity from nuclear because of Fukujima and Chernobyl nor treat our water with chlorine because some trucker dumped sulfuric acid into a hypochlorite tank nor drink beer because a huge vat once burst drowning many and destroying a London neighborhood. We should all huddle in our yurts and heat our yogurt over a wood burning stove

I think yogurt is disgusting, but warm yogurt just sounds completely and utterly repulsive.

 

[Crissa]

I think yogurt is disgusting, but warm yogurt just sounds completely and utterly repulsive.

What do you think curry is?

-Crissa

 

[Dids]

What do you think curry is?

-Crissa

Coconut milk, curry leaves, peppers, tumeric. Although I suppose you could swap out coconut milk for yogurt, but that would be nasty.

 

[Shumby]

Coconut milk, curry leaves, peppers, tumeric. Although I suppose you could swap out coconut milk for yogurt, but that would be nasty.

need a little flower and butter in there